Visions of Tomorrow’s World With Chinelo Onwualu
This episode features a conversation with writer, editor and strategic communications consultant, Chinelo Onwualu. It was recorded in March 2025.
Chinelo is co-founder of Omenana, a magazine dedicated to African speculative fiction, and is the former chief spokesperson for the African Speculative Fiction Society. She’s also one of the reviewers of entries for Grist’s Imagine 2200 climate fiction contest.
Her writing has been featured in several anthologies and magazines, including Uncanny magazine, Strange Horizons, The Kalahari Review, and Brittle Paper.
It has also earned her many merits including a nomination for the British Science Fiction Awards, as well as for the Nommo Awards for African Speculative Fiction, and also the Short Story Day Africa Award.
With a background in journalism, Chinelo previously worked as a reporter and online editor in Nigeria and the United States, including as a senior editor for Cassava Republic Press, one of the leading independent publishers in all of Africa.
In her consultancy work, Chinelo has spent more than a decade supporting multi-national non-profits across the world with their strategic communications, including WE Charity International, ActionAid Nigeria, The BBC World Trust, and the University of Sussex's Institute for Development Studies.
Amongst other things, Chinelo and I discussed the importance of stories in shaping our societies, how fiction can help us make changes in our real lives, and what Western storytellers might learn from those whose cultures have already faced apocalyptic scenarios.
Additional links:
Visit Chinelo’s website
Grist's Imagine 2200 climate fiction contest
Check out Omenana
Peruse Rosarium Publishing and Flame Tree Press
Explore Roy Okupe’s comics
Discover Nightmare magazine and Uncanny magazine
Read more about Chinese author Cixin Liu
Dickon: Hi and welcome to Communicating Climate Change, a podcast dedicated to helping you do exactly that. I'm Dickon and I'll be your host as we dig deep into the best practises and the worst offences, always looking for ways to help you - and me - improve our abilities to engage, empower and ultimately activate audiences on climate-related issues.
This episode features a conversation with writer, editor, and strategic communications consultant, Chinelo Onwualu. It was recorded in March 2025.
Chinelo is co-founder of Omenana, a magazine dedicated to African speculative fiction, and is the former chief spokesperson for the African Speculative Fiction Society. She’s also one of the reviewers of entries for Grists’s Imagine 2200 climate fiction contest.
Her writing has been featured in several anthologies and magazines, including Uncanny Magazine, Strange Horizons, the Kalahari Review, and Brittle Paper. It has also earned her many merits, including a nomination for the British Science Fiction Awards, as well as for the Nommo Awards for African speculative fiction, and also the short Story Day Africa Award.
With a background in journalism, Chinelo previously worked as a reporter and online editor in Nigeria and the United States, including as a senior editor for Cassava Republic Press, one of the leading independent publishers in all of Africa.
In her consultancy work, Chinelo has spent more than a decade supporting multi-national non-profits all across the world with their strategic communications, including WE Charity International, ActionAid Nigeria, the BBC World Trust, and the University of Sussex's Institute for Development Studies.
Amongst other things. Chinelo and I discussed the importance of stories in shaping our societies, how fiction can help us make changes in our real lives, and what Western storytellers might learn from those whose cultures have already faced apocalyptic scenarios.
So, let's get on with it. This is Communicating Climate Change with Chinelo Onwualu.
The first question is one that I ask everybody and that's from your perspective, how can communication best contribute in humanity's response to the climate crisis?
Chinelo: I don't know that there's any way to tackle the climate crisis without communication. Communication is the bedrock of what it means to be human. We are one of the few species who have the range and diversity of language that we do. We are one of the few species for whom we have a written version of our languages. In fact, that's not something that actually even naturally occurs to us, like written language, for instance, only shows up when you have the kinds of imperial bureaucracies that require record keeping.
So, we have this amazing ability to not only with create this diversity of ways of communicating with each other, but to do so in multiple formats. And so, I don't know that it's possible to tackle any kind of challenge as a species without communication. I don't even know how you would conceptualise that.
We are such a communication-based species that it would not be possible for us to even imagine what it would be like to try to solve something without communication.
I mean, every species that has to work together as a unit, from ants to amoeba, have forms of communication, whether those are like chemical trails or clicks. So yeah, it would not be possible. In fact, it would be foolhardy to think that we could without communication.
Dickon: What does fiction bring to the table that other communication formats don't?
Chinelo: So, fiction is learning through imagination and we have come to think of learning through information, imparting facts, imparting statistics, as superior form. But I think that's a result of that, you know, post-Enlightenment, rationality movement.
But for most of human history, the way we passed on information, if we wanted to keep aspects of culture alive, if we wanted to warn each other about dangers in our environments, if we wanted to pass on inherited knowledge, we did it through stories. We told stories of gods and monsters that explained the universe. That try to explain the human psyche. That tried to explain to each other what it meant to be a good person and what we should ascribe to. And we told stories to entertain ourselves.
I mean, when we're sitting around in front of a campfire with not a whole lot to do, the things we seem to have come up with is dancing, music. And then the third thing is storytelling, right? And we do this across cultures. We do this from hunter-gatherer societies to tech-obsessed tech bros, high on Ayahuasca, I mean we're all doing it right.
And so I think what storytelling brings to the table is kind of a shortcut to the most basic form of communication there is. When I want to tell my kid something that I know is going to stick, I don't sit them down and drone on about like “why you need to do a thing.” I tell them about the kid who stuck a fork and… You know, “…And then he died!” and that seems to stick.
So I think that the thing that storytelling brings is one, it shortcuts our brains right to our emotional centres, and we know that humans don't make decisions based on rationality. We say we do. We like to think we do. But the truth is we make our decisions purely based on our emotions, purely based on how stories move us.
And so what storytelling brings to something like the climate crisis is a powerful appeal that gets right to the heart of how human beings make lifestyle changes and why human beings make lifestyle changes, especially really, really big ones that might affect their comfort that might affect their social standing. Things like that.
And it also provides us a vehicle for how to think of the future. And I think in particular, that storytelling through speculative fiction, which, I would argue is how we've always told stories - speculatively - magic, gods, you know, monsters. It gives us this way of thinking about the future that excites, that inspires that really, really gets to the heart of how we make sustainable change.
If you talk to any rational scientists, they'll likely tell you that what got them into science and technology was something sci-fi, right? Star Trek, the golden age of science fiction, Arthur C Clarke, etc. And it's something that you can see even governments have taken notice of.
So China, a few decades ago, made a decision that it wants more participation in its STEM, and so what they did was make a deliberate choice to invest in science fiction. To give money to science fiction writers to promote science fiction and fantasy conventions and awards and things like that, and what they've reached now is having some of the most dynamic science fiction right now that's not in English, right?
And so to me, that is why speculative fiction in particular is so important to the climate movement, because it is how we're going to tell stories about the future that will actually stick, and will get people invested and engaged.
Dickon: So, the concept of storytelling has perhaps never been more hyped by communicators as a vehicle for connection and change than at the present moment. But which tropes do you think are utterly played out? What needs to be re examined and shaken up when it comes to telling stories around climate?
Chinelo: My first answer, my quickest and first answer, is the dystopia. Particularly dystopian fiction that valorizes a certain kind of rugged individualism. That assumes that in the face of large scale systematic fracture and breakdown, what will immediately arise are motorcycle gangs, cannibalism, and patriarchal systems like warlords, you know, taking women off the street. I think that that is one set of a certain kind of person’s imagination. And I think it's not even held up by reality, very often. And it only looks at things from a very particular, very narrow perspective. So, I think a lot of the tropes I see that I would say are played out are things like the kind of fiction that inspires fear rather than hope and optimism.
And it's funny because in the wake of the COVID-19 epidemic, a lot of writers for whom this was something that they did a lot kind of started moving away from it, or didn't find the appeal in it even for themselves. Because what they realised is that it's one thing to write about the apocalypse. It's quite another to kind of live through it. And once you kind of, you know, tasted it a little bit, you're like maybe this is not what they want.
And the thing about dystopias is that they're often written as cautionary tales and then taken as Bibles or as road maps. And so, many times, you write these stories hoping to warn people against going down a certain path, and some people look at it and go, “Man, that's so cool. I totally want to live in a world where you can download your memories and, you know, commodify people's brains” and, you know, the writer was like, “No, this story was about corporatism.”
Like, a great example of that would be something like Fight Club, where it was literally supposed to be warning against how toxic masculinity can be corporatized and you know, it turned out that a bunch of people saw it and thought, “This is cool. This is what it means to be a man.”
And so I think my first answer would be the dystopia. The “how bad can it get?” Not to say that there isn't value in them. I think that we are at a point where what we need more than anything is storytelling that inspires hope. That inspires change. That inspires people to work towards the possible positive outcome. When we work from a place of, “I don't want to go there.” What you end up having is a preservation of the status quo where people are much more invested in keeping what they have than in working towards something that might be radically different.
What we need are more utopias is my argument, where people get to see what life could be like. More visions of a future that we want rather than the future that we don't want because we have road maps to those already. What we lack are road maps to the places we actually do want to go. More utopias, more wild ideas, more crazy imaginings that people will go, “What? How do we even get here?” Less The Walking Dead and more Star Trek.
Dickon: Yeah, I mean, you're talking to someone who grew up on the Next Generation. I mean, it was pure utopia, all day long.
Chinelo: Yeah, all day, every day. And you don't see enough of those. We watched Jurassic Park and we had this upsurge in people becoming archaeologists across the world. It's documented. Jurassic Park comes out and then archaeology blows up, right? When Jurassic Park came out in China, you see this rise of discoveries of fossils in China because so many more people decided they wanted to be archaeologists.
The thing is, those people also decided, “What if we could bring back dinosaurs?” So the whole point of the movie kind of went right over people’s heads and they were like, “But what if we could?” And now you have the search for what it would be like to bring back extinct animals.
When you present dystopias, what often happens is that people kind of either go, “oh, I don't want that to happen. Let's hold on to what we have.” Or “Ooh, I like that one interesting piece of technology. Let's see how I can replicate it.” Even if that piece of technology was what was causing the downfall.
Dickon: Many climate stories still centre around Western perspectives. How can other storytelling traditions reshape both global climate narratives but also, potentially the way we communicate them?
Chinelo: The ways that Western perspectives end up creeping into these storytelling practises is that very frequently it thinks of the climate collapse or the climate crisis as the loss of Western comfort and power. And from that perspective it is a catastrophe, right? If white people lose the ability to, like, hoard the immense amounts of resources that they do, I can see how many would think of that as this terrible, awful thing that we must stop at all costs. But global perspectives don't follow that right?
If you think about the ways that people outside of the West use their resources. You don't have to convince people to recycle because there isn't that much of a disposability culture. There is the idea that you take whatever you find and you build from what you get, instead of buying something new. And then when that new thing breaks, you throw it away and buy another new thing. Right?
And so even that shift of mindset. I think can sometimes, maybe for people living in the West, be considered a catastrophe, and then that fear is what I feel like is driving a lot of political movements to the Right, to these false promises of nostalgia, of restoring some mythical past greatness that maybe never was or never will. And so when you're talking about how Western perspectives are centred, the second part of it is the Hero syndrome, where the West really does believe that they will find the answers and then distributes it out liberally to the rest of the world, who are all just waiting in thrall for the West to come up with these things.
The image of Africa as a continent that keeps coming up is “they produce the least, but they will suffer the most, and so we must help them.” Rather than this understanding or idea that maybe Africans are doing things on their own that we might want to type into, to see what's going on and to see what we can learn from these countries, learn from these places where people are already used to they can do with what they have with stretching resources that aren't abundant, with reconfiguring what's on the ground to make it work better.
And so there really is this sense of paternalism that shows up in Western storytelling and the sense of catastrophization, the imagination that should the climate crisis worsen, we're all so terribly ******.
I think the West has a lot to learn from peoples and cultures that have actually faced apocalyptic situations. If you're talking about something that I know, for instance, the transatlantic slave trade, and what that must have been like to people, you could have been picked up anytime, taken away to an incomprehensible land and basically worked to death in a labour camp. That's apocalyptic. If you think about the genocide of native peoples, you’re chilling one day and some guy shows up and wipes your people out. That's pretty apocalyptic. So there are groups that have survived mass catastrophes and still have found ways of thinking, ways of relating ,ways of surviving, that I think the West could learn from.
That's encapsulated in the storytelling as well, right? Because stories are the ways that we communicate most effectively. If you're looking for new ways or new ideas or new perspectives, maybe to start from that position rather than the positionality that we know everything, and if our dominance is challenged or if we're no longer centred then everything collapses. Not to downplay the the severity of the climate crisis, but certainly to maybe de-center some of the loudest perspective so far, I think that would be a great start.
Dickon: From your extensive experience of these genres, speculative fiction, cli-fi, etc., what are some of the imagined climate realities that you think hold the most potential for inspiring folks and sparking new thinking about where we're headed, and why?
Chinelo: I think that what inspires people is incredibly subjective. Two people can read the same thing, and one person comes out of it like fully depressed and the other person is like, “Oh my God, I'm so excited.” Narratives that have some sort of clear through line right from where we are to where we will be seem to be what really, really get people excited. So, when you create uptopias, it's not as inspiring as the idea that this utopia is taking place in the same universe that I'm occurring in, but in the future, in a future where everything has gone right. I think one of the appeals, for instance, of multiverse, for a lot of people, is this idea that somewhere, somehow, there's a version of me that is living their absolute best life. That is much happier, much more prosperous, in a society that's more equitable, more beautiful, than where I am now. And I think that cuts across political spectrums, that cuts across, you know, class, gender, the idea that somewhere, somehow, this world could be better.
So I just came back from a conference in Rwanda where a bunch of African thinkers, philosophers, writers and scientists got together to basically imagine Africa’s most optimistic future. And. In all these scenarios, some, like certain themes emerged. So, for instance, the vision of a borderless continent where people could cross borders at will, where the false nation states that were created out of these colonial experiments had been dismantled and people were free to live within their own ethnic traditions. As well as communicate and trade without barriers.
And so this sort of calls back to this imagined past, but also reaches towards an imagined future. And I think that that's what gets most people the most excited, reaching towards an imagined future that you can see happening because you took XYZ steps. And I think that's also why some dystopias are so appealing. Because you can see so clearly the through line between now and there, right?
People love escapism, but it doesn't inspire in the same way. You don't see people working actively to make the world of Game of Thrones a reality, right? It was a cool way to spend a Sunday night, but it's not something that I wake up, you know, going, “What can I do to my job today to make Game of Thrones real?”
I think that what is most inspiring to people is the kind of storytelling or the kind of imagined futures across you know, whether it's cli-fi, whether it's different kinds of sci-fi, that we can see ourselves getting to.
And that will take me back to China, because what I've seen happen is this concerted effort within the government to encourage science fiction. But science fiction that was explicitly science based. Cixin Liu is a great example of this, in which he bases a lot of his work on existing science. So he's imagining, for instance, a Chinese space programme that rivals or surpasses NASA, right? He's imagining scientific advances that reach towards alien life and then have that alien life reach back towards us, right? And so in this way you seen this flourishing of Chinese science fiction as well as Chinese science. Reaching towards the imagined worlds of science fiction has pictured for it.
And on the continent, in the last 15 years, I've watched the rise of African speculative fiction. The slight difference is that a lot of the speculative fiction coming out of the continent is often very folkloric, often reaching into our oral histories to figure out ways to understand the world that we live in now.
But there is also a lot of African science fiction that is imagining our futures. Futures in which we have done things like build massive sea walls in Lagos, right created monarchical kingdoms in Malawi that conserve populations of elephants and rhinos, as we're seeing the climate crisis deepen on the continent, we are reaching forward with our imaginations as to what kinds of ways can we address these things. And, what if? What if there was no restriction on cost? What if there was no neoliberal meddling? What if there was aid systems that work for us instead of against us? What if we have instituted rehabilitative and restorative justice systems that are based in our traditional justice structures? Things like that. And the clear through line I think is that as you start to take seriously certain kinds of challenges, you have to think imaginatively about them and the ways that we've managed to do that is always through our stories.
Dickon: I remember reading that there was a government strategy to redefine male Chinese characters in film and stories, to redefine how Chinese men see themselves and what's possible for them. Not so long ago, the trope of the kind of Chinese member of the team, it's very one-dimensional. And then suddenly you end up with heroes that completely defy the old trope. It’s interesting how government decisions to invest in imagination can send this ripple into the real world.
Chinelo: And it's usually not like a top down thing. It's usually government sort of noticing what's there, finally noticing something that may have been going on for a long time. A great example of that is the Hallyu wave out of Korea. K-dramas are not new, K Pop is not new, but what happened was that the government realised that this is an amazing opportunity to reshape Korean self power in the world, and so then poured money into it and the fine balance you have to get with that is that if you jump in with the authoritarian hammer and are like you can only say this and this and this and this, what you get is propaganda and propaganda is not very inspiring but if you are clever, the way America - and America is great at this, they basically drew the blueprint for soft power through art and how you shape how other people view you - But what it does is that it shapes how we view ourselves and what we are aspiring to.
And so something that has been interesting for me is within African speculative fiction, is redefining gender. So you see in the West, lots of cool technology, but we're still patriarchal, right? Lots of cool technology, but it's still gender relations that read like something out of the 1950s. And so the challenge is, is that you're not just pushing the science or the scientific imagination, you're also pushing social imagination. What you notice is a great example of that, that you can socially engineer populations by crafting the spaces in which imagination goes or doesn't go.
That's not to say that there hasn't been lots of examples of utopian fiction in the in Western literature, it's that for, maybe, the powers that be, it hasn't been considered particularly useful. If you just listen to how hard Star Trek thought just to exist and continues to fight, and even now newest iterations of it are increasingly darker and darker and darker, you know, exposing the grim underbelly of this, you know perfect utopia.
In many ways, there is already kind of an appetite for that. The Tech Bros really want an apocalypse. Against which they can then prove that they have meaning in some ways. I mean, you don't get to be a hero until the world falls, so you kind of need the world to fall so that you can rise out of the ashes, the rugged hero that you think yourself to be.
Dickon: For folks looking to expand their understanding of climate fiction and climate storytelling beyond the mainstream, where should they go? What authors, publishers or platforms? Should they be paying attention to?
Chinelo: I mean, you've talked to Tory Stephens about the climate ancestors storytelling competition, right? I'm sure he gave you lots of information around that. But there are some interesting ones. So, for instance, the biggest one is Amenana. So, Amenana is a magazine of African speculative fiction that I used to edit, but is now currently edited by Iquo DianaAbasi. It is published about four times a year and it is some of the most interesting speculative fiction coming out of the continent.
Another great place to find African speculative fiction and climate fiction would be Flame Tree Press, so they have a couple of anthologies. They tend towards more folklore. And Rosarium Publishing is another publisher that does these great anthologies that include really interesting examples of African storytelling.
Climate futures is this programme coming out of the Stockholm Resilience Centre at Stockholm University. It's run by Laura Pereira and her students. They put together last year or the year before an anthology called the Nature Futures Anthology. It is written by speculative fiction authors from Malawi.
There are some great comics, for instance, Roye Okupe is a comic book author and he's got some good stuff out there. But the truth is, they're everywhere. They show up in, like, Uncanny magazine and Nightmare magazine, in small tiny presses on the continent and major publications. It is widely proliferating, but it's also quite diffuse.
Dickon: What's the single most important aspect of communication that we should be paying attention to in our communication endeavours?
Chinelo: Our audience reception. Sometimes when we put out messaging, we don't think necessarily about how people are going to react. We don't always think through context in which people are receiving messaging. There was this mistake that is made that people are these vessels that you can pour messaging into and they will react exactly as you hope they will.
As a fiction writer, I know that once my stuff is out there, I cannot control how people take it. I cannot control how people react to it. The best thing I can try to do is present my vision in as cogent and coherent a way as possible, so that it can have the emotional impact that I want it to.
If I want people to finish my story and be in tears, that's what I work towards. What they do with those tears I cannot say, I cannot control and I don't try to. But if I want people to finish my story with a sense of. “Ohh man, that was great!” That's what I worked towards.
And so I think that we don't pay enough attention to the emotional impact that we want to elicit with our messaging, super good example of this is the civil rights and gay rights movements in the United States. What they were going for was emotional reactions that they could then use to push people into pre-planned political actions, right?
For instance, we have all these political actions that we want people to take and we're very good at that within the climate movement. What emotion do we want to elicit in people so that they then go take those? And what we've been relying too often on is fear, but we forget that people, when they are afraid, don't then go out and vote for progressive things. They go back, they find comfort, they they regress. It's not until they're shaken out of that by something violent like an authoritarian take over in the United States that then people start thinking, “oh, what could we have done better?” But if you want people to make progressive change, what you need to inspire in them is not fear, it's excitement. It's not dread or helplessness. It's hopefulness and a sense of going forward.
One thing I've seen coming out of speculative fiction in China is this carefully crafted sense of forward movement. Of hopefullness. This idea that we are reaching towards this golden Chinese dominated future, in which everybody's going to live happily ever after, and we're all doing it and in hand, marching towards… And I think that's what the climate movement should be thinking about. What are the ways that we want to inspire people to change, not terrify them into movement, because that's not working.
Dickon: So, on the flip side, what's the biggest mistake that you see communicators make when attempting to engage the public on climate change issues?
Chinelo: I think the biggest mistake people make is that if we just throw enough facts at them, they will see the light. I won’t lie, it's good to be grounded in fact, but the facts alone are not telling the story. Facts alone are not moving people emotionally right? Facts become a thing that you now start debating with fake climate scientists. So people who just deny fact entirely and tell you to go screw yourself. “I don't care what the numbers say, I believe…” and you see this with anti vaxxers, right? You can give anti vaxxers fact upon fact upon fact. But the minute you start telling them the story of how you lost someone to a disease that had a vaccine, then you start making those connections with people. We have our facts and we keep getting more facts. We're not going to run out of facts. What we need to do is start leading with stories and what we need to do is start leading with different kinds of stories. Stories about the potential future that we want to see, stories about the world that we want to leave our children with, stories about what is possible, what is reachable, not far-flung, utopias that we can never hope to get to because people can dismiss that and say, “oh, it's not realistic.” But utopias that are grounded in history that have clear, actionable pathways to reach towards.
I’ll cycle back to the conference, I was just attending. We did some future mapping in which we said this is the future we want to get to. What are the major world events that need to happen? In order to get us to that future that emerged, like the collapse of debt, for instance, we are going to need to wean ourselves off these like false debt programmes that actually keep us enthralled to these like neocolonialist powers, those things are going to have to collapse.You're going to need to create education centres that incorporate both indigenous knowledge systems and Western knowledge systems.
So, these are actionable steps that we need to take. Actionable ways we need to change the way people think to get us to these places. And that's invaluable. We don't do that enough. The more we can do that, the more I think will lead to inspiring stories that then push people to actually want to make change, even in their own small ways.
Dickon: It was a real pleasure talking to Chinelo for this episode, but what in particular stuck with you from our conversation? What will you take from it and apply to your own work?
For me it was this idea of seeking knowledge of how to prepare for and process apocalypse from those who've already been through their own. The desperate need to look up and out of our silos, particularly in the global north, and see what we can learn from others, or perhaps collaborate with on scaling up. This is the theme that will come up in subsequent episodes too, particularly around adaptation and behaviour change in a post 1.5° of warming world. It definitely deserves more attention. I'm sure you'll agree!
Then, hearing how Chinelo as a fiction writer first considers the intention of our output, and only then begins working towards that intention, totally caught me off guard. I never thought about that process showing up in fiction writing. That's how we do things in marketing or strategic communications, right? Some of you might be familiar with the AIM framework, for example, A for audience, I for intent, and finally M for message. The actual writing, the message, comes last once all those other aspects are in place. I never thought of fiction writing as being quite so deliberate. But how often do we in all kinds of contexts and working on all kinds of executions, skip those first parts and simply dive headlong into whatever it is we want to say? It's intuitive, perhaps, to think that that's how great writing happens. But here's Chinelo telling us, even in fiction, it's the more considered approach that is likely to generate the best results.
Finally, I loved hearing about those visioning sessions from Chinelo's recent travels in climate communication and also in social change research, there's a great focus on giving folks concrete next steps to take in response to a challenge or a need for change, rather than broad, abstract calls for action. This is something we often fail at doing sufficiently well. Here though was Chinelo telling us that the stories and the visions that generate the most engagement, and the most inspiration, are those with a clear path to reach them. Even when we're visioning creating fictions in the minds of our audience about where we want to go with them, the need for a breadcrumb trail of how we'll actually arrive at those outcomes remains essential.
So that's what I'll be taking with me. But how about you? What did you hear? What will you be incorporating into your communications endeavours?
Thanks to Chinelo Onwualu for sharing her time and insight with the show, it was great. You can find some links to relevant resources in the show notes.
Thanks also to you for listening to Communicating Climate Change. If you enjoyed this episode, why not leave it a rating or a review? Your feedback not only helps to shine a light on the guests. And themes that resonate with you the most, but also boost visibility, meaning the series reaches more people expanding the community and driving the conversation forward. After all, that's what it's all about.
You can find more episodes wherever you get your podcasts, or by subscribing so you never miss out. You can find Communicating Climate Change on LinkedIn too, and if you think the series would be of interest to friends or colleagues, why not point them in the right direction.
Remember, each and every episode attempts to add to our toolkits. To help us develop the openness and the imagination that we'll need for this global task, so be sure to stay tuned for more. For anything else, just head over to communicatingclimatechange.com.
Until next time. Take care.
